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Hall of Shame There are lots of cruel and inconsiderate people out there. Expose their cruel deeds to the world and let them be shamed!

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  #121  
Old 06-10-2009, 10:38 AM
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Default Re: Campaign Stop puppy and kitten Backyard breeder do trade through Pet Shop

Quote:
Originally Posted by firdaruddin View Post
Itu adalah definasi untuk "Backyard Breeder". They do sell those cats with different price and without certificates. Kalau dengan certificate n proven cert for their parent, adakah itu masih kamu kategorikan sebagai backyard breeder?
your question already have the answer at mention, inside What exactly is a "backyard breeder"?
since you like to know more how the backyard breeder do trade through Pet Shop, You need check with regular pet shop have selling pet, you may ask them where this animals came from, how you trade and also asking are you Backyard breeder, it said by petfinder.my forum. When you get more inform, you may share with us here.
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  #122  
Old 06-10-2009, 11:07 AM
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Default Re: Campaign Stop puppy and kitten Backyard breeder do trade through Pet Shop

Quote:
Originally Posted by pandorabox78 View Post
surgery cannot and should not be performed by a non-vet.... it's illegal and against the law.... report to the veterinary counsel at once if you encounter such experiences

just my 2 cents
Doc,
Thank you for the comments, you know many people still unknow what is "Vet" and "look like Vet",
let my experince about "Vet", Vet need to obtain a veterinary degree from university and All veterinary courses cover the major species of animals encountered in practice (e.g. cattle,
sheep, pigs, horses, dogs, cats and birds). It is not possible to specialise in one particular species until the veterinary degree is obtained.
Vet is follow the protocol and procedures used in vaccination and surgical care of animals.

"look like Vet", They learn from Backyard breeder with years experince, using own animals and customer pet for practice.
"look like Vet" what is protocol and procedures used in vaccination and surgical. You never know, because he never study. I think youtube might have. check on youtube!

To all pet loving, above as simple view by me about vet, you all can see the differ. By the way Thanks petfinder member pandorabox as vet for comments.
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  #123  
Old 06-10-2009, 05:15 PM
ashleywong ashleywong is offline
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Default Re: Campaign Stop puppy and kitten Backyard breeder do trade through Pet Shop

To sum up:

1) Only obtain veterinary advice from qualified veterinary clinic, if price is of concern, you can choose from govt veterinary clinic.

What is important to note here : the term "private" is used to distinguished it from govt-run veterinary clinic when we talk about vet. In terms of qualification, they should all be properly qualified and properly registered.

Private DOES NOT EQUATE "illegal veterinary practices" / unlicenced veterinary services or unlicenced / unqualified persons masquerading as veterinary doctors. (i believe the human equivalent would be a "QUACK"?)

Illegal veterinary practices, unlicenced veterinary services or unlicenced / unqualified persons masquerading as veterinary doctors are just that - illegal and unqualified to provide veterinary services - no two ways about it. (in this case, a spade should be called a spade and not some Politically-correct terms).

If in doubt, you can check a list of registered veterinary doctors - i'm sorry i can't recall the link to the list - when i find it again, i'll be sure to post it here.

(i checked out this list to see whether my vets are listed here and they are , before i patronised them, and i've never looked back since).

Also if you are in doubt of the service rendered or to be rendered, always ask questions first before committing (unless it is emergency). Even if it is emergency, ask questions if you need to ask them, don't be embarassed. A good vet will not hesitate to share with you his thoughts and opinions and advice and options that you have at your disposal - including options that may be the best for your wallet as well as your pet - good professional vets are like this - i'm sure a number of forum members who have come across professional vets will attest to this

If you have done your homework and still persist in patronising unqualified veterinary services, your pet will suffer as a result of your selfishness and self-centeredness.

2) This is for new pet owner as well as "veteran" pet owner: a timely reminder : Please do not scrimp on veterinary costs and avoid taking your pet to the vet just because you think it is expensive. It all boils down to whether you care enough for your pet, if you care, you can always ask this forum to recommend several reputable vets and ask about the charges before seeing the vets to get an idea of what is the usually charges for this or that service and what you get is only an estimate because the final bill will depend on the condition of your pet, in fact you can always call a vet and ask for charges, say you want to spay/castrate a dog/cat, you can always call a vet to check whether they provide the service, whether they are certified, and what are their charges,

This opinion of mine is in no way meant to belittle those who sometimes do feel the $$$ pinch - i too feel the $$$ pinch, as are all who double up as IPR out of our own pocket money / salary. And the price definitely influence your decision especially if your paypacket s finite but your rescued "furkids" are forever expanding (not that you're complaining cos you're doing it for love of them).

However if you're unsure, it always pay to take vet's advice, and no question is to stupid to ask. Especially for new pet owner. Over time, as you build your relationship with your vet, you will learn how to spot a situation that required immediate vet attention from one that you may observe for a few days to be sure. (i was once a wet-behind-the-ears new pet owner of 4 kittens and i still remembered the times i dithered between going to the vet or not, etc. how long was that? about two years ago - seemed like such a long time my cats have grace my life with their presence).

Whenever your pet is not its usual self for a few days, it is always good to eliminate medical reason for the "unusual or not usual behaviour / self", for this you take your pet to a qualified vet and share all information you have on pet with your vet, then if medical reasons is eliminated, at least you have the peace of mind that your pet is not sick then only focus finding out other reasons for the unusual behaviour /self

The initial "Start-up" vet cost may be slightly high (in our mind we can't equate the price charged compared to the severity/non-severity of the complaint). but over time as you have ensured your pet is in good health and fed properly, your pet and you will definitely reap the benefits of your diligence in providing good vet care as a foundation to good life for your pet.

Try as you might to "sound out" your friends here for advice, etc, nothing beat solid advice from vets.

3) The topic at the heart of this discussion - as you love your furkids, spare a thought for the suffering of those furkids not fortunate enough to have a good home - through non of their fault and all because of human greed - those who were born and bred to fill greedy people's pockets. If you truly love animals the way you claim you are, you cannot failed to be moved by their plight and you cannot be indifferent to their plight and to the main source of their suffering - .....people who breed them and sell them only for profits and not for the pets' welfare..

if you boycott Backyard-cat-and-dog-and-other-animal-breeding-and-selling practices, be it one that is operated through a network of pet supplies store or operated out of an individual's house, . you'd be contributing greatly to ensuring that one day, this horrible practice is put to a stop, and by that, you'll also contribute to reducing the suffering of these animals.

if you wish to have a pet or want to give your love to a pet, consider adoption - there are so many abandoned and homeless animals in need of a loving permanent home - a chance for a life lived in dignity, security and love. You will never know how much it means to these animals - to you it means you have a new pet - but to them (the animals) it often means the difference between being alive with happiness and free of suffering OR either a life lived out in misery or slow painful death.


RECOGNISE AND RESPECT THE SANCTITY OF LIVES OF OTHER SENTIENT BEINGS AS YOU DEMAND THE SAME FOR YOURSELF

ENSURE THE OTHER SENTIENT BEINGS ARE NOT SUFFERING THE WAY YOU WOULDN'T WANT SUFFERING BE VISITED UPON YOU

ENSURE THE HAPPINESS OF OTHER SENTIENT BEINGS THE WAY YOU WISH FOR THE SAME HAPPINESS

IF THE BUYING STOP, SO WILL THE SUFFERING
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  #124  
Old 06-10-2009, 05:25 PM
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Default Re: Campaign Stop puppy and kitten Backyard breeder do trade through Pet Shop

it's all commie bull****.no need to provoke anyone.we discuss this matter in general but you...personally name a person.it's that fair?i'm tired of this.good bye.
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  #125  
Old 06-10-2009, 05:37 PM
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Default Re: Campaign Stop puppy and kitten Backyard breeder do trade through Pet Shop

Quote:
Originally Posted by firdaruddin View Post
it's all commie bull****.no need to provoke anyone.we discuss this matter in general but you...personally name a person.it's that fair?i'm tired of this.good bye.
I cannot understand what you said, would you tell in more detail. I only know as i understand i'm tired of this.goodbye. Seen you cannot accept of your admire friend in this Hall of Shame thread, in reality that is, myself also cannot believe what happened, later will know how it look like. Since you tired and goodbye. I dont want ask you a question. thank you for coming.
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  #126  
Old 06-10-2009, 05:50 PM
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Default Campaign Stop puppy and kitten Backyard breeder do trade through Pet Shop

Ashley,you post got me thinking. I'm amused when everybody start to say not to BYB,stop buying from petshop selling animals etc. Come on,I believe,everyone of us here are guilty for patronising this kind of petshop.Does Petsmore,Pets Wonderland, ring a bell?? (many more petshop,but can't remember the name except for Jimmy's.I know he didn't sell livestock). Buying toys,cage,litter sand etc etc from this kind of shop?? Some buy animals from Certified Breeder. Is there any different?? No difference to me. Still buying instead of adopting.

2nd thing, when we rescuers being judged just because we buy from certain petshop. First of all, have this people ever lift their finger to rescue any animals?? Only feeding? Makes me want to laugh very hard.Is that what they call rescuer?? Do they know our hardship?? Have to deal with the law (DBKL, MMPJ, MPAJ etc), have to tightening our belt,difficulty to find new home for nto so beautiful cats. All they do here is cheering and doing pom pom dance. That's all.

All I ask for this people to do look yourselves in the mirror and examine yourself. I didn't say we are better,or holier than thou but at least we try instead of talking and yakking without doing anything. Pls put yourselves in our shoes before shoot us with all kind of accusations.

Tell me, am I wrong to say this??
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  #127  
Old 06-10-2009, 05:55 PM
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Default Re: Campaign Stop puppy and kitten Backyard breeder do trade through Pet Shop

Quote:
Originally Posted by June View Post

Tell me, am I wrong to say this??
nope not at all, understand your frustration very well.
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  #128  
Old 06-10-2009, 06:17 PM
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Default Re: Campaign Stop puppy and kitten Backyard breeder do trade through Pet Shop

well said!

Quote:
Originally Posted by dog is my buddy View Post
Everyone to continue Campaign Stop puppy and kitten Backyard breeder do trade through Pet Shop, let me explain more about it.

What exactly is a "backyard breeder"?
Someone who breeds unregistered purebred animals and sells them as purebreds without papers, or some with paper too, and display at Pet shop, another word Backyard breeder sell to me, I sell to my pet shop customer. It is easy for a quick buck. This going drastically undercuts the price of registered purebred breeders.
The pet shop and Backyard breeder who does not care who buys their animals or for what purpose. They won't care after sell. Don't want to know your problem. Also does not offer a health guarantee, contract or even take the phone number of buyers.
Almost can see from pet shop place their animals for sale. This quality of this animals no thought or care to good companion animal husbandry and or care to genetic good health or defects.
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  #129  
Old 06-10-2009, 06:31 PM
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Default Re: Campaign Stop puppy and kitten Backyard breeder do trade through Pet Shop

Quote:
Originally Posted by aliciahorsley View Post
well said!
Alicia,
Thanks for came to this thread, as you doing pet shop business, what do you think those puppy and kitten Backyard breeder do trade through Pet Shop.
can you feel this type pet shop can sell the pet supplies lower down as much as can from retail price? You know why, they can cover the cost by selling pet. Those customer happy order from this type pet shop. But they still dont know, it is support to Backyard breeder. They should stop buying from this pet shop.
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  #130  
Old 06-10-2009, 06:35 PM
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Default Re: Campaign Stop puppy and kitten Backyard breeder do trade through Pet Shop

Quote:
Originally Posted by June View Post
Buying toys,cage,litter sand etc etc from this kind of shop?? Some buy animals from Certified Breeder. Is there any different?? No difference to me. Still buying instead of adopting.
There can be a difference because when you buy from an ethical breeder, you do not contribute to the problem of more unwanted cats in that your kitten will be neutered before you take it home. also, the breeder should be taking excellent care to make sure he never sells unneutered pets to lay people who may take up breeding without adequate thought/research/commitment to ethics.

adopting is well and good but some ppl simply cannot adopt. if you have children, adopting a stray adult dog can be risky. if you have children, then a pedigree is also easier because they just seem more adapted to home life. my first dog was a stray from off the streets. the frist two years of life with her were difficult to say the least. she was never happy indoors and even now, at the grand age of eight, still finds living as a pet tiresome. (My sheeri baby is happiest running free and exploring, but hiking, her fav activity, is not easy with three kids under in tow) many would've chucked her back out on the streets for all the stuff she destroyed. if you budget is tight, adopting a stray can be expensive in the long run becuase of underlying health problems. i adopted my first cat from the spca and he turned out to be FeLV+ and infected with sporo. in the 8 months that i had my darling mel, he cost me over RM1800 to treat!

while this is most certainly not the case for all strays, i certainly understand the attraction is buying a pedigree from ethical breeders.
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  #131  
Old 06-10-2009, 06:42 PM
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Default Re: Campaign Stop puppy and kitten Backyard breeder do trade through Pet Shop

Sorry, an accidental post! :)
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  #132  
Old 06-10-2009, 06:45 PM
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Default Campaign Stop puppy and kitten Backyard breeder do trade through Pet Shop

I know Alicia.I just want to make a point to certain people who are judgemental towards us.

By the way Alicia.do you know that certain certified breeder works hand in hand with BYB?? I'm shocked to know that but it is true. So I guess the right word will be ethical breeder.


Quote:
Originally Posted by aliciahorsley View Post
There can be a difference because when you buy from an ethical breeder, you do not contribute to the problem of more unwanted cats in that your kitten will be neutered before you take it home. also, the breeder should be taking excellent care to make sure he never sells unneutered pets to lay people who may take up breeding without adequate thought/research/commitment to ethics.

adopting is well and good but some ppl simply cannot adopt. if you have children, adopting a stray adult dog can be risky. if you have children, then a pedigree is also easier because they just seem more adapted to home life. my first dog was a stray from off the streets. the frist two years of life with her were difficult to say the least. she was never happy indoors and even now, at the grand age of eight, still finds living as a pet tiresome. (My sheeri baby is happiest running free and exploring, but hiking, her fav activity, is not easy with three kids under in tow) many would've chucked her back out on the streets for all the stuff she destroyed. if you budget is tight, adopting a stray can be expensive in the long run becuase of underlying health problems. i adopted my first cat from the spca and he turned out to be FeLV+ and infected with sporo. in the 8 months that i had my darling mel, he cost me over RM1800 to treat!

while this is most certainly not the case for all strays, i certainly understand the attraction is buying a pedigree from ethical breeders.
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  #133  
Old 06-10-2009, 07:10 PM
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Default Re: Campaign Stop puppy and kitten Backyard breeder do trade through Pet Shop

One should not be made to feel "guilty" about having a pedigree pet.
One is only "guilty" if he/she closes one eye to any unscrupulous practices known to him/her upon getting a pet.

Having a pet is a very personal thing, it is like what we say, "Beauty is in the eyes of the beholder ...".
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  #134  
Old 06-10-2009, 07:16 PM
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Default Campaign Stop puppy and kitten Backyard breeder do trade through Pet Shop

That is so true. What disturb me most since yesterday when I found out certified breeder work together with BYB and unfortunate cat lovers bought this cat. When this people were told,they don't believe it. aiyoh!! so serba salah.


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Originally Posted by sillylupie View Post
One should not be made to feel "guilty" about having a pedigree pet.
One is only "guilty" if he/she closes one eye to any unscrupulous practices known to him/her upon getting a pet.

Having a pet is a very personal thing, it is like what we say, "Beauty is in the eyes of the beholder ...".
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  #135  
Old 06-10-2009, 11:42 PM
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Default Re: Campaign Stop puppy and kitten Backyard breeder do trade through Pet Shop

Just for clarification's sake....

June, first of all, the opinions and comments here which you felt are judgemental towards animals rescuers is NOT an across the board statement. Well, at least, for me, as I can only speak for myself. It is not targeted towards all animal rescuers. Perhaps you misunderstood, due to recent developments.

There are genuine animal rescuers here, whose work I deeply respect and would never belittle. At the same time, there are so-called animal rescuers who don't walk the talk.

They close their eyes to activities that are totally against everything they claim to believe in. For example, there is even one so-called animal rescuer who I understand is a BYB herself, but would never admit to that, and would even tell everyone that she is anti-BYB. If being upset at such hypocrisy is considered judgemental, then I guess we have different definitions on what judgemental is.

Second, it seems that there is another type of animal rescuer. This type opens an animal shelter, and then starts a pet shop. Tells all the customers about the animal shelter and asks them if they would like to donate to the shelter. The customers felt obligated, and so bought more pet food which they left behind with the pet shop owner for her animal shelter. What do you call this?? Sincere animal rescuer??!! Sounds more like an opportunist to me.

So, those who know of such activities and still support such activities really have no right to go around making the claims they are making about how they are animal rescuers. They are making a mockery of the real animal rescuers.

As for whether everyone of us here are guilty of patronising petshops that sell animals, yes, at one point all of us are. I used to buy my pet products from Petsmore Kepong and Pet Safari at Ikano. But I've stopped doing that now that I understand the living conditions of those poor animals in the shops. And I am sure those who supported this campaign have also stopped buying from those pet shops that sell pets.

Third, there is a difference between a BYB, kitten/puppy mill and an ethical breeder. A certified breeder does not mean he or she is an ethical breeder. A certified breeder, if breeds their cats or dogs like Imadi Pet Shop, is called a kitten mill or puppy mill.

Hope this clarifies what this campaign is about. Anybody who encounters any unethical pet shops, BYBs or kitten/puppy mill is encouraged to share their personal experience here, without fear or favour, be they Chinese, Indian, Malay or others.

Quote:
Originally Posted by June View Post
Ashley,you post got me thinking. I'm amused when everybody start to say not to BYB,stop buying from petshop selling animals etc. Come on,I believe,everyone of us here are guilty for patronising this kind of petshop.Does Petsmore,Pets Wonderland, ring a bell?? (many more petshop,but can't remember the name except for Jimmy's.I know he didn't sell livestock). Buying toys,cage,litter sand etc etc from this kind of shop?? Some buy animals from Certified Breeder. Is there any different?? No difference to me. Still buying instead of adopting.

2nd thing, when we rescuers being judged just because we buy from certain petshop. First of all, have this people ever lift their finger to rescue any animals?? Only feeding? Makes me want to laugh very hard.Is that what they call rescuer?? Do they know our hardship?? Have to deal with the law (DBKL, MMPJ, MPAJ etc), have to tightening our belt,difficulty to find new home for nto so beautiful cats. All they do here is cheering and doing pom pom dance. That's all.

All I ask for this people to do look yourselves in the mirror and examine yourself. I didn't say we are better,or holier than thou but at least we try instead of talking and yakking without doing anything. Pls put yourselves in our shoes before shoot us with all kind of accusations.

Tell me, am I wrong to say this??
Quote:
Originally Posted by June View Post
I know Alicia.I just want to make a point to certain people who are judgemental towards us.

By the way Alicia.do you know that certain certified breeder works hand in hand with BYB?? I'm shocked to know that but it is true. So I guess the right word will be ethical breeder.
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  #136  
Old 06-11-2009, 01:38 AM
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Default Re: Campaign Stop puppy and kitten Backyard breeder do trade through Pet Shop

dear dimb,

ask the vet for a show of his/her APC (annual practising certificate) to ascertain that he/she is a true vet... if one cannot be produced... do not patronise that establishment

just my 2 cents


dear june,
hope that your friend's kitten is doing ok...
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  #137  
Old 06-11-2009, 02:06 AM
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Default Re: Campaign Stop puppy and kitten Backyard breeder do trade through Pet Shop

Doc,
Need check with victim where the provide vet service was mention. also need check with sub-contract the spaying/neutering Pet shop introduced to victim with lower price was promotion at advertised in pet shop thread.
If real vet, it more horrendous the skill in spaying/neutering!

Quote:
Originally Posted by pandorabox78 View Post

dear dimb,

ask the vet for a show of his/her APC (annual practising certificate) to ascertain that he/she is a true vet... if one cannot be produced... do not patronise that establishment

just my 2 cents


dear june,
hope that your friend's kitten is doing ok...
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  #138  
Old 06-11-2009, 09:40 AM
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Default Re: Campaign Stop puppy and kitten Backyard breeder do trade through Pet Shop

Quote:
Originally Posted by June View Post
That is so true. What disturb me most since yesterday when I found out certified breeder work together with BYB and unfortunate cat lovers bought this cat. When this people were told,they don't believe it. aiyoh!! so serba salah.
Why so hard to believe, June? Why so serba salah? Hey, this is the real world lah, got all sorts of people, rambut hitam hati lain-lain ... don't be so gullible in life, you will be the salesman and con-man's favorite target .... they will eat you up for lunch and dinner ....

Well, June ... put it this way ... "certified" and "honest" are waaaaaaaaaay 2 very, very different things, kay? just tell your friends not to be so gullible ... "certified" does not necessarily mean "honest" i.e. a "certified" breeder is not necessarily an "honest" person though the good ones try to maintain honesty in their business dealings with their valued customers so as to jaga the business reputation and brand name.

But in every field, there are "bad apples" ..... crooks everywhere! Beware always and never be so trusting, even your so-called close friend or relative ... the Chinese got a saying, I think ... which goes like "Cheat the regular customer and friend, but not the stranger" .... something like that laa .....
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  #139  
Old 06-11-2009, 11:08 AM
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Location: Tmn Shamelin Perkasa-Kota Kinabalu
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June is on a distinguished road
Default Campaign Stop puppy and kitten Backyard breeder do trade through Pet Shop

Bro,terkejut and hard to believe because the breeder yg dicanang canang as ethical breeder. Tak sangka rupanya pun 2 x 5. I wonder why no one from the certified breeder post it here.Takut ke or their own buddy buddy??

Serba salah sebab kwn2 tak mau percaya.Blh kata slandering pula. I wash my handlah.


Quote:
Originally Posted by FurKids View Post
Why so hard to believe, June? Why so serba salah? Hey, this is the real world lah, got all sorts of people, rambut hitam hati lain-lain ... don't be so gullible in life, you will be the salesman and con-man's favorite target .... they will eat you up for lunch and dinner ....

Well, June ... put it this way ... "certified" and "honest" are waaaaaaaaaay 2 very, very different things, kay? just tell your friends not to be so gullible ... "certified" does not necessarily mean "honest" i.e. a "certified" breeder is not necessarily an "honest" person though the good ones try to maintain honesty in their business dealings with their valued customers so as to jaga the business reputation and brand name.

But in every field, there are "bad apples" ..... crooks everywhere! Beware always and never be so trusting, even your so-called close friend or relative ... the Chinese got a saying, I think ... which goes like "Cheat the regular customer and friend, but not the stranger" .... something like that laa .....
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  #140  
Old 06-11-2009, 11:19 AM
June June is offline
Animal Lover
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Tmn Shamelin Perkasa-Kota Kinabalu
Posts: 6,004
Rep Power: 0
June is on a distinguished road
Default Campaign Stop puppy and kitten Backyard breeder do trade through Pet Shop

This 'she' you mentioned here, I think I know her.

Who is this animal shelter cum petshop cum opportunist?? I think forumers must be inform abt them also.

One more need to be expose is certified breeder working with BYB.


They close their eyes to activities that are totally against everything they claim to believe in. For example, there is even one so-called animal rescuer who I understand is a BYB herself, but would never admit to that, and would even tell everyone that she is anti-BYB. If being upset at such hypocrisy is considered judgemental, then I guess we have different definitions on what judgemental is.

Second, it seems that there is another type of animal rescuer. This type opens an animal shelter, and then starts a pet shop. Tells all the customers about the animal shelter and asks them if they would like to donate to the shelter. The customers felt obligated, and so bought more pet food which they left behind with the pet shop owner for her animal shelter. What do you call this?? Sincere animal rescuer??!! Sounds more like an opportunist to me.
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