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Training & Behavioral Issues Does your dog have an attitude, or just simply refuses to listen to you? Share it with your peers here and learn more about a cat's behavior and training methods

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  #1  
Old 02-24-2009, 03:24 AM
miket miket is offline
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Default ... our Dog Whisperess? What is this?

I joined this forum a few months back and realise there's a distinct lack of understanding about dogs in this forum and probably a large part of the population in Malaysia.

Yet, everyone posts all kinds of info on breeding advise, wagging tail, tastes and so forth. Then I saw this post about "Cheng See, our Dog Whisperess". That was the last straw for me.

WHAT IS DOG WHISPERING? How about dog listening? Maybe dog speaking? Then dog mumbling? Also, dog shaking? WHAT IS ALL THIS JUNK???

Do you guys and gals on this forum really think it's BLACK MAGIC MUMBO JUMBO DOG WHISPERING to train a dog? If you do, my advise is to give your dog away or cull it because nothing is happening between your dog and you unless you have this WHISPERING AND MUMBO JUMBO skills.

Dogs have senses, humans have brains. So, as humans, use your brains to understand dogs' sensing ability and then use that to train them. That's it. Stop all this psycho babble whispering! It doesn't help anyone.

Cheng See is a dog trainer, not a WHISPERER/MUMBLER/BLACK MAGIC artist or anything like that. Dog trainer. Simple as that. And you can be one too if you are serious about learning about dogs and as committed as Cheng See.
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  #2  
Old 02-24-2009, 10:53 AM
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Default Re: ... our Dog Whisperess? What is this?

geez miket,
i'm pretty sure no one in this forum actually thinks that training their dog involves black magic or psycho babble. whoever referred to cheng see as the dog whisperer, just meant that she has a way with dogs, perhaps a better understanding of how to train them and communicate with them.

i certainly think its not fair of you to suggest that people give their dogs away or cull them simply for using the term "dog whisperer" to refer to an outstanding dog trainer.
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Old 02-24-2009, 12:38 PM
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Default ... our Dog Whisperess? What is this?

Well said lynie.


Quote:
Originally Posted by lynielime View Post
geez miket,
i'm pretty sure no one in this forum actually thinks that training their dog involves black magic or psycho babble. whoever referred to cheng see as the dog whisperer, just meant that she has a way with dogs, perhaps a better understanding of how to train them and communicate with them.

i certainly think its not fair of you to suggest that people give their dogs away or cull them simply for using the term "dog whisperer" to refer to an outstanding dog trainer.
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  #4  
Old 02-24-2009, 12:42 PM
BellXun BellXun is offline
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Smile Re: ... our Dog Whisperess? What is this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by miket View Post
I joined this forum a few months back and realise there's a distinct lack of understanding about dogs in this forum and probably a large part of the population in Malaysia.

Yet, everyone posts all kinds of info on breeding advise, wagging tail, tastes and so forth. Then I saw this post about "Cheng See, our Dog Whisperess". That was the last straw for me.

WHAT IS DOG WHISPERING? How about dog listening? Maybe dog speaking? Then dog mumbling? Also, dog shaking? WHAT IS ALL THIS JUNK???

Do you guys and gals on this forum really think it's BLACK MAGIC MUMBO JUMBO DOG WHISPERING to train a dog? If you do, my advise is to give your dog away or cull it because nothing is happening between your dog and you unless you have this WHISPERING AND MUMBO JUMBO skills.

Dogs have senses, humans have brains. So, as humans, use your brains to understand dogs' sensing ability and then use that to train them. That's it. Stop all this psycho babble whispering! It doesn't help anyone.

Cheng See is a dog trainer, not a WHISPERER/MUMBLER/BLACK MAGIC artist or anything like that. Dog trainer. Simple as that. And you can be one too if you are serious about learning about dogs and as committed as Cheng See.


Hahaha Relax miket. relax~~~ Breath in.... breath out....

I think ppl just said it metaphorically. Alot of people lack understanding of dogs(maybe including me) But, as long as they are learning frm forum and not teaching in forum. i think its okay. just relax. Its just some words ppl use. try not to get too emotional about it. If not u'll really have a hard time in forums (this forum n other forums too), coz in forums ppl just say watever they think, some are misleading some are helping. so it is up to the READER's own discression/wisdom on what info to absorb n what info to reject.

Try not to Blame others for posting stupid threads, just train urself to filter it away as u read them. :)

Cheers.

Peace~ Peace~~~~


:)
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  #5  
Old 02-24-2009, 12:46 PM
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Default Re: ... our Dog Whisperess? What is this?

I agree 100% with Lynie & Bellxun. Relax, miket.
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  #6  
Old 02-24-2009, 12:58 PM
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Default Re: ... our Dog Whisperess? What is this?

in the world only Cesar Millan able calling Dog Whisper. Cesar Millan is a world-renowned dog behavior specialist, known for his uncanny ability to walk large packs of dogs at a time. Not only that but, from poodles to pit bulls, these now well-behaved canines have each been rehabilitated, rescued from a wide range of extreme behavior issues. visit my blog have two article by Cesar Millan http://petmyforum.com/?cat=16
Other trainer call him self as Dog Whisper, it was copy cat!
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  #7  
Old 02-24-2009, 01:47 PM
miket miket is offline
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Default Re: ... our Dog Whisperess? What is this?

Good responses ... and don't worry, I am not in a rage. It was a rant! And I am feeling better.

Yes, I realise it is a metaphor but, if I have any say, I would ask that such metaphors not be used in dog training. Metaphors are not useful because it only serves to mystify - NOT demystify - the world of dogs and their realtionship with owners. To use an analogy, legal work is not black magic either but many incompetent lawyers use tons of jargon to mystify - NOT demystify - the legal profession. Then you pay tons of money and not get any real legal service and end up going to jail, or pay the fine, or losing your legal case. Familiar to anyone?

The only reason anyone would use mumbo jumbo (jargon) is to make it nearly impossible for end-users (consumers like you) to understand dog training. If you cannot understand, then you are in no position to question whether their techniques and approach to training YOUR dog is appropriate. Then they put your dog through the paces and you end up thinking, OOH! I have a trained dog. How nice! A trained dog because there were mumbo jumbo uttered. That's not what dog training is and most just don't realise it.

For those of you who know what it is, you should be using the correct terminology so others may learn. This way, everyone benefits. Wouldn't it be better to have such a positive end-result?

For those that don't, please take Cesar Milan as a human being, not a whisperer nor anything else. It's just a marketing thing dreamt up in Hollywood and everyone rushes out to buy/download his jargon. I suppose that's why the say there's no place like Hollywood! Don't ge me wrong, Cesar does some good things but all he really focuses on is dominance concept (pack leader) and release energy (exercise them on treadmills) - this is absolute basic issues for novice dog owners.

Too much of this alpha / pack leader concept screws up YOUR mind, and end-result is a dog trained to ignore YOU or run-away when you approach your dog. I have seen it a few times because they keep watching MR WHISPERER's videos. I then have to unwind the screwed minds of the owners. More on this later.

Far better to learn dog training from real professionals like Ivan Balabanov, Susan Barwig and many others at Canine Training Systems (http://www.caninetrainingsystems.com/) where they sell books and videos.

Finally, a clarification, I have spoken with Cheng See once. So I don't know what she does exactly. If what she does work, then go ahead. To my knowledge, she has never used that silly label on herself. And that shows maturity.

For Tigerland K9 Academy, what they do is predominantly Schutzhund (SchH). I have not seen them work their dogs and I would not comment other than say, do not go into Schutzhund sports until and unless you can get past obedience. If owners cannot even develop a basic dog-handler bond, there is huge risk in handling SchH titled dogs, let alone training dogs in SchH. Remember, handling and training is two very different things.

I am not a trainer nor breeder - been there, done that. My suggestions has no potential conflict of interest because I don't care whether it's popular (marketable). The ones I help, I do it because friends have asked for help. Otherwise, I ignore the owners because they have caused the problem by not reading and thinking what dog ownership really require (especially the larger working breeds). So, if you've learnt anything, enjoy your dog. Otherwise, I wish you luck.

Last edited by miket; 02-24-2009 at 02:37 PM.
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  #8  
Old 02-24-2009, 03:11 PM
Ferreted Ferreted is offline
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Default Re: ... our Dog Whisperess? What is this?

ahahaha.. miket.. i thought what happened to you.. heehee.. amusing thread.. not much info but heehee can see the types of each ppl that respond to this rant.

Dog whisperer, would be like harry potter and the parsel tounge tellin snakes what to do.. no trainings required. So unless he's bark tounge..

Scenarios:

real life:
DW: "WOF BARK BARK WOOOF *with intonations* ARF ARF AUUUUUUFFF..."
DAWG: *huh*
DW: BARKY BARKY BARK
DAWG: *wtf..*
DW: "WOAUAOAEUOEAOEUAE.. ah see, i just told him to be quiet"
DAWG: *wth..*

HHAHAHAAHAH DANG I AM ROFLMAO, khikhikhi..

so unless he can:

DW (10 metres away, no gestures): "BARKY BARK BARK BARK" or "pssstttttt" (i will chop ur balls if u dont listen, now sit!)
DAWG (random dog): *stare up and down* ( SHEESHH, okay dood, CHILL YO!, whats the dilli-yo with all y'all ppl and us puttin our asses yo!"
*dog sits*

then he is no whisperer... i still hope for second scenario, that would be freak of nature.. COOL.

That is my rant, ahahaha.. i feel you miket, ppl should be responsible of their dog outcome, dog trainers or so called "whisperess" knows how to train.. but not the above scenarios.. hehehe so.. hehehe... i feel good.

Anyway.. i didnt find dog whisperess cheng see, i only saw yen's dog behaviorist post. doesnt matter tho, just a rant..
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  #9  
Old 02-24-2009, 08:23 PM
miket miket is offline
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Default Re: ... our Dog Whisperess? What is this?

hi Ferreted,

Good one. It's good if they get it, otherwise, I tried.
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  #10  
Old 02-25-2009, 10:13 AM
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Default Re: ... our Dog Whisperess? What is this?

My dear friend, Miket

No black or white magic at all, it is just your off target imagination.

The phase is just a simple compliment (tabik!) for our dear Cheng See who has helped many seemingly difficult (according to their exasperated owners la!) dogs. Obviously you haven't read the famous book "The Horse Whisperer" or watched its movie starred by Robert Redford. The expression comes from there. But no black magic, dude! Aduhai! Ke sana pergi nya ...

Me ... I aspire to be a cat whisperer ... it helps very much in rescue work, especially the real feral ones which are a huge challenge in order to successfully catch/trap them for neuter/spay because it is really heart-wrenching to watch small and newborn kittens dying being thrown into the garbage dump/chute, drains, streets and being killed by dogs. Better not to be born.

Peace, friend! Treat yourself to a nice teh si kosong halia ... me enjoying one right now ... cheers!
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Last edited by FurKids; 02-25-2009 at 10:36 AM. Reason: Tambah teh si ... heh! heh!
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  #11  
Old 02-25-2009, 11:35 AM
Ferreted Ferreted is offline
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Default Re: ... our Dog Whisperess? What is this?

Tell me when y'all found a true whisperer.. hehehe i want to let the person teach me the art.. then i'll be ms. dolittle's.. like in the movie.. or i's be goddamn rich animal psychiatrist.

*off to read harry potter's parsel tounge excerpts..
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  #12  
Old 02-26-2009, 01:54 AM
miket miket is offline
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Default Re: ... our Dog Whisperess? What is this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by FurKids View Post
My dear friend, Miket

No black or white magic at all, it is just your off target imagination.

The phase is just a simple compliment (tabik!) for our dear Cheng See who has helped many seemingly difficult (according to their exasperated owners la!) dogs. Obviously you haven't read the famous book "The Horse Whisperer" or watched its movie starred by Robert Redford. The expression comes from there. But no black magic, dude! Aduhai! Ke sana pergi nya ...

Me ... I aspire to be a cat whisperer ... it helps very much in rescue work, especially the real feral ones which are a huge challenge in order to successfully catch/trap them for neuter/spay because it is really heart-wrenching to watch small and newborn kittens dying being thrown into the garbage dump/chute, drains, streets and being killed by dogs. Better not to be born.

Peace, friend! Treat yourself to a nice teh si kosong halia ... me enjoying one right now ... cheers!
My dear FurKids

Before you go any further with accusations of "off-target imagination", let me just say you obviously have read Evan's 'Horse Whisperer' and did not understand a single thing? It's called natural horsemanship.

In the words of Nicholas Evans, author of Horse Whisperer:
"...Probably for as long as man and horses have known each other, there have always been people who seemed to know what was going on inside a horse's head. Sometimes they were seen as witches and some were even burned at the stake because when a horse went berserk, it was thought the devil was in him and, by extension, anyone who could expel the devil must, it was thought, have some kind of magic power." (my emphasis)

So, still think it's my imagination? Or, is it your ignorance of horsemanship history?

Should you be so flippant about using words like 'cat whisperer' and the like? Instead of sipping teh tarik and looking cool, you're better off learning not just animal training, but history too. Here's the source of the quote: http://nicholasevans.com/faq/faq.asp

Finally, you can stop your bleeding heart lines about cats. Doesn't work on me. Whispering will not help cats either. Only knowledgeable owners will. You might want to try to be one? That might help the cats you're trying to save.

Stay warm and well.

best regards
miket

Last edited by miket; 02-27-2009 at 01:46 PM.
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  #13  
Old 02-26-2009, 11:25 AM
June June is offline
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Default our Dog Whisperess? What is this?

Miket,Furkids have FULL knowledge abt cats. He helped a lots of forumers here on cats. He know cats on his back of his hand I would say. He even suggested to us on which books abt cat we should buy. I bought the book and I give FK 2 thumbs up. You may notice his knowledge abt cats from his posting around here. I don't mind calling him Cat Whisperers

Quote:
Originally Posted by miket View Post
My dear FurKids

Before you go any further with accusations of "off-target imagination", let me just say you obviously have read Evan's 'Horse Whisperer' and did not understand a single thing? It's called natural horsemanhip.

In the words of Nicholas Evans, author of Horse Whisperer:
"...Probably for as long as man and horses have known each other, there have always been people who seemed to know what was going on inside a horse's head. Sometimes they were seen as witches and some were even burned at the stake because when a horse went berserk, it was thought the devil was in him and, by extension, anyone who could expel the devil must, it was thought, have some kind of magic power." (my emphasis)

So, still think it's my imagination? Or, is it your ignorance of history of horsemanship?

Should you be so flippant about using words like 'cat whisperer' and the like? Instead of sipping teh tarik and looking cool, you're better off learning not just animal training, but history too. Here's the source of the quote: http://nicholasevans.com/faq/faq.asp

Finally, you can stop your bleeding heart lines about cats. Doesn't work on me. Whispering will not help cats either. Only knowledgeable owners will. You might want to try to be one? That might help the cats you're trying to save.

Stay warm and well.

best regards
miket
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  #14  
Old 02-26-2009, 03:30 PM
Ferreted Ferreted is offline
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Red face Re: our Dog Whisperess? What is this?

HEY GUYS the root issue is not personal, what Miket tried to say is that dog whisperer is a wrong jargon that people use for trainers/behaviorists (which was made famous by Cesar Millan's show).

That it is not mumbo jumbo as how "whisperer" originally means.

His point is that if we keep using the word whisperer, we'll associate the ability to understand dog's nature and the capability to train them with something ELUSIVE.
Tat it is okay to be a CRAP owner/trainer cause we are not "whisperer".

anyway this is just miket's rant.. dont take it personally or seriously.

(v. i.) To rave in violent, high-sounding, or extravagant language, without dignity of thought; to be noisy, boisterous, and bombastic in talk or declamation; as, a ranting preacher.

i think we all should look into dogs training that this topic brought up, to learn than to pick on words.

it is frustrating sometimes... well.. this forum is not much entertainment for dog lovers, not enough of us, and so much to learn.

cheers..
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  #15  
Old 02-27-2009, 12:39 AM
miket miket is offline
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Default Re: our Dog Whisperess? What is this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ferreted View Post
His point is that if we keep using the word whisperer, we'll associate the ability to understand dog's nature and the capability to train them with something ELUSIVE.
Tat it is okay to be a CRAP owner/trainer cause we are not "whisperer".

anyway this is just miket's rant.. dont take it personally or seriously.
Hey Ferreted,

I don't know you personally, and from your pix, you seem young but I think you just might have it with domesticated animals. So, please forgive me if this is beginning to seem like a mutual admiration society but you're pretty sharp, and seems nice as well. So, that's cool!

If anyone wants to take a deep sigh and stop defending imagined corners, here's another book (yep, I know, reading never ends in my world) - "In the company of animals" by James Serpell (1996)
http://books.google.com/books?id=v9g...sult&ct=result

Have a good read.
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  #16  
Old 02-27-2009, 08:41 AM
Ferreted Ferreted is offline
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Default Re: our Dog Whisperess? What is this?

heehee.. yippiee!! of course i am sharp.. i am just acting goofball most the times..

"na na na na na"... khikhikhi eases the mind..
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  #17  
Old 03-02-2009, 12:32 PM
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Default Re: ... our Dog Whisperess? What is this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by miket View Post
My dear FurKids

Before you go any further with accusations of "off-target imagination", let me just say you obviously have read Evan's 'Horse Whisperer' and did not understand a single thing? It's called natural horsemanship.

In the words of Nicholas Evans, author of Horse Whisperer:
"...Probably for as long as man and horses have known each other, there have always been people who seemed to know what was going on inside a horse's head. Sometimes they were seen as witches and some were even burned at the stake because when a horse went berserk, it was thought the devil was in him and, by extension, anyone who could expel the devil must, it was thought, have some kind of magic power." (my emphasis)

So, still think it's my imagination? Or, is it your ignorance of horsemanship history?

Should you be so flippant about using words like 'cat whisperer' and the like? Instead of sipping teh tarik and looking cool, you're better off learning not just animal training, but history too. Here's the source of the quote: http://nicholasevans.com/faq/faq.asp

Finally, you can stop your bleeding heart lines about cats. Doesn't work on me. Whispering will not help cats either. Only knowledgeable owners will. You might want to try to be one? That might help the cats you're trying to save.

Stay warm and well.

best regards
miket
Miket, lu apa sakit dan apa gigit sama lu ahhhh? Apasal your suhu sonang panjat upstairs aje? Stay COOOOL, dude! Kalau tak leh tahan differences in opinions, tak usah masuk gelanggang le, bang oiiii!!!!
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Old 03-02-2009, 12:36 PM
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Default Re: our Dog Whisperess? What is this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by June View Post
Miket,Furkids have FULL knowledge abt cats. He helped a lots of forumers here on cats. He know cats on his back of his hand I would say. He even suggested to us on which books abt cat we should buy. I bought the book and I give FK 2 thumbs up. You may notice his knowledge abt cats from his posting around here. I don't mind calling him Cat Whisperers
Alaaaa, June, tak der laaaa ... tak ader la sampai mcm tu ... June pergi angkut bakul berat saya ni sampai kembang hidung saya ... rupa dah mcm kuda lak ... my cayangs takut lariiiiii .....

Excuse me, I am going to whisper some sweet nothings in my pretty girl cayang's ear now ...
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